need help on choosing brakes

[jdo009]

hydraulic brakes from mgp cost 185 and the normal disk brakes cost 40 what kind of stoping distance differents are we talking about b/c i don't want to spend 145 more if its not really needed or gonna make a differents

[Papa]

At first I didn't like the mechanical brakes because it seemed to take forever to get the bsr stopped. After alot of trial and error I finally fabbed a much shorter mounting bracket and different hardware and now it will lock the tires up pretty easily. I was on the verge of purchasing a hydraulic set up. Glad I kept messing around with it.:thumb: I guess it's a matter of personal preference also.

[mrpenguin]

My first one had mechanical brakes and they seemed a bit wimpy so I bit the bullet and bought hydraulic. It's only an opinion but so far I dont think the juice was worth the squeeze. It doesnt stop noticeably better and cost a bunch more money. I'm also just the slightest bit cautious about the cable pulling the master cylinder lever. Seems just a little too iffy.

[kkuenemann]

Here is my opinion. I would opt for the hydraulic if you have the cash. I have used both on a Go Kart and the hydraulic was way better. My 55 lb son can lock up the brakes on his 325 lb racing cart with Hydraulic brakes with little leg effort. He can not do so on our other kart with mechanical brake. For a BSR, one issue to consider is the hand strength of the rider, the hydraulic set up will take less effort.......just my 2 cents worth....

[mrpenguin]

The problem is all the slop in the cable. Even when it's adjusted nice and snug there is inherent "give" in the works. A foot pedal and solid linkage would work great, but that's not really possible on a BS.

[2nstoys]

I just put hydralic an my bsr and it is worse than the mechanical. I will be putting the latter back on. Don't waste the money. Just my .02

[Mike Bean]

At first I didn't like the mechanical brakes because it seemed to take forever to get the bsr stopped. After alot of trial and error I finally fabbed a much shorter mounting bracket and different hardware and now it will lock the tires up pretty easily. I was on the verge of purchasing a hydraulic set up. Glad I kept messing around with it.:thumb: I guess it's a matter of personal preference also.

Hey Papa,

Can you post a photo of your modified setup of the brakes for us to check out?

Thanks.

[Mike Bean]

I put hydraulic brakes on the new BSR I just built and I am using the hand brake with a cable to pull the arm. I also noticed better stopping power than the mechanical, but I still am not able to lock up the rear tires.

One of the problems I noticed is that the plunger that pushes the brake pads in, retracts when letting off the brake lever; unlike a car the plunger stays in position. So now I have about 1" of travel on the master cylinder arm with no stopping power applied yet. Has anyone else noticed this?

I have been thinking about getting the hand brake lever with the master cylinder built in. But I am still concerned about the plunger retracting when letting off the brake lever.

Mike

[Mike Bean]

I just put hydralic an my bsr and it is worse than the mechanical. I will be putting the latter back on. Don't waste the money. Just my .02

You need to do some adjustments to the setup to get better stopping power. I preloaded my master cylinder by pulling it a bit forward and then putting the cable in. Give that a try, it took me a bit to figure that trick out, and now is does stop better then the mechanical.

Mike

[elvergon]

Yeah, you should start bracking since you put the force on the lever. Might have just a very little gap where they won´t work, but of course is not a 1" long.

[2nstoys]

I have been playing with it for about 2 weeks and thought I had it good. It tends to keep changing. I have 3 different holes in the arm at the master for the leverage. Preloaded the master but if you let it sit more than a couple days it kind of bleeds back. I did have it adjusted so it would lock up the rears but so did my other caliper. I may play with it more but the mechanical is just so much easier to set up and not mess with. Besides, who uses the brakes anyway. WFO

[kkuenemann]

Mike, Your post stated that the plunger retracted... The set up I have used in the MCP Mini Lite. The caliper on it has adjustments to set the pads a given distance from the rotor on both sides. The m/c has two lines that run to the caliper, one to each side. I set the at rest position of the pads at about 0.070". I bleed the brakes so that there is only a short movement of the m/c arm to apply the brakes. If some one could adapt or make a braket to mount the m/c on the handle bars with a solid rod to the lever (like a motorcyle hyd. clutch lever), then the slop would be gone from the cable. I think I just gave myself and idea to work on....:thumb:

[jdo009]

so which one should i go with btw i found the mcp kit for 150

[Mike Bean]

kkuenemann,

I also have my pads adjusted in like yours, but I can see the piston on the bottom left (not sure about the others) retracting all the way back away from the pad when I let off the brakes.

Has anyone called MCP on this?

Mike

[kkuenemann]

Mike,

I had trouble like you and 2nstoys, I changed with way I blead the system. I started out by setting the pad position. I removed the m/c cap and filled. Next I would open the bleeder screw and SLOWLY move the m/c arm in and out to allow the air to work out of the system on both ends (make sure to keep the m/c full. I did this for both sides (one at a time). This method made my pedal rock hard, and only have to move the lever on the m/c about 1/2" with my linkage in the middle hole on the arm.

I plan on changing my BSR to hyd brakes, but currently it has the mech caliper you sell....:dizzy:

[Mike Bean]

kkuenemann,

Ok, I blead my brakes before I adjusted my pads.. Makes sense now. I am assuming you closed the bleeders once you moved the master cylinder arm all the way to prevent air from back flowing?

Thanks,
Mike

[Prowrench22]

The Hydraulic system by MCP which is the same as on most american made go karts uses larger brake pads then the mechanical, if you do not provide the proper leverage to a Hydraulic master cylinder it won't work as well.

Fact is the hyd. system is better your just not using it correctly, you levers are wrong.

Lets put cables back on your cars if they work so great.

[kkuenemann]

kkuenemann,

Ok, I blead my brakes before I adjusted my pads.. Makes sense now. I am assuming you closed the bleeders once you moved the master cylinder arm all the way to prevent air from back flowing?

Thanks,
Mike

Mike, you are correct, just leave the cap off of the m/c and keep it full.

[CritterBuddy]

I'm not an expert by any means with brakes but have MCP brakes on my current Shrine parade vehicle and experience with various mechanical brakes on others. Here's a couple of things to ponder from personal observations.

Hydraulic brakes tend to work better because they normally have larger brake pads and brake discs. Hydraulic brakes can also exert more pressure on the pads to the disc due to greater physical dynamics of fluid vs mechanical. I have seen excellent results with a "homemade" mechanical system but it had both an oversize brake disc and pads not normally found together in commercially available packages.

To the best of my knowledge, MCP brake systems only use DOT 5 brake fluid (full synthetic) which is not compatible with other fluids. Anything else could give you varying results and definately do not mix DOT 5 with anything else.

Two problems I found with using any brake system engaged by a hand lever and cable is whether or not the hand lever has enough travel to fully engage the brakes and the amount of "flex" you have in the cable. This was a problem on my wife's little buggy until I realized it and changed to a different hand lever which had more travel. Cable flex can be a problem because the longer the cable is the more flex it will have before it can fully engage the brakes. I haven't tried it myself, but you might consider trying to shorten the cable length and converting some of the distance to your brake pads to a metal rod. Something like using a cable to get to the frame in a short distance and have it pull a metal rod the rest of the way to your brake pads.

Like any brake system, a hydraulic system must be adjusted properly in order to perform properly. This is a problem I've seen on several vehicles whether hydraulic or mechanical and usually involves too great a distance between the brake disc and pads. Be sure to read the instructions which come with your system for proper adjustment. For example, I've seen where a hydraulic system was properly bled but the operator made no attempt to properly adjust the pads to the disc - hence no brakes.

Hope this helps.....

[sweav]

Hey Mike, on the piston retracting back into the caliper. I talked to mcp last week and what I was told to take care of that is get the system bled out, w/ the cap off of the master, short stroke the master. I was told this will pump more fluid into the system and get the pistons out to the pads. The way it was explained to me was that when you apply the brakes the port the alows fluid into the system is shut off and when the m/c comes back to the resting position the vacume created sucks the piston back in. I'm setting up a dual disc set up on my parade car right now. Built it with the carlilse mech. brakes, heavy cables running to both calipers and it wouldn't stop near what I needed to. The other thing mcp told me to do was to remove the springs inside the adjusters, I don't know if it's because I'm running 2 calipers off of 1 master. Hope this helps

[Mike Bean]

Hey Sweav,

I went to the MCP website and bled the brakes according to their information and the pad still retracts back, but I can now lock the brakes up at speed which I was not able to do before. I do not know why the vacuum of the master cylinder has to pull the pads bad. On cars I have never had this problem before.

But thanks for the info any ways... I will keep it in mind if I ever have to bleed the brakes again...

Mike Bean

[sweav]

Mike, when I talked to mcp, you don't have to do it when you bleed them. You just remove the cap off of the master and do shorts strokes, not fully engageing the beakes. With the cap removed it won't pull a vacume and it will let the system fill with fluid. The masters on cars and bikes are totally different then these. The way he talked it was a normal thing with them.